[00:00:00] Right now, the world needs great men who will stand up and lead with honor, serve with purpose, and courageously fulfill their God given roles and responsibilities as husbands, fathers, leaders, and men. It's time we see more men thrive, marriages filled with passion, and families that flourish. So whether you're a man struggling to figure it all out, or an awesome husband and dad looking for the next level, you've come to the right place.
We're your hosts, Franklin Swan and Tanner Hayes, bringing you practical, applicable tools and strategies you can use every day to build yourself into the man God is calling you to be. This is The World Needs Men. Let's go. Welcome back to the World Needs Men podcast. I am your host [00:01:00] today Franklin Swan And I have the honor and privilege of introducing today's guest Greg Amundsen to the show Greg has served over 22 years In state and federal law enforcement including roles with the SWAT team in Santa Cruz He has been a special agent with DEA, a DEA liaison to the Border Enforcement Security Task Force Thanks and a military police captain with the U.
S. Army. Greg is an ordained minister, and he has an integrated approach combining faith and fitness as a way to introduce people to Jesus. He is known as the original fire breather. Greg was one of the early pioneers and founding athletes of CrossFit and has lectured and coached extensively on the CrossFit methodology.
Uh, he's an accomplished author of over a dozen books, including fire breather fitness and the warrior and the monk. Greg is the host of the Greg Amundsen show podcast, and I could keep going on for more time than we have on this [00:02:00] show. But, uh, Greg, it is such a pleasure and privilege to have you on the show and, uh, and just really excited to dive in today.
Franklin, thank you for having me on your show, brother. Well, I guess let's start off. Just tell, tell us a little bit about yourself, introduce who you are and a little bit more depth to, uh, to our, our listeners and, um, just kind of give us a sense of who you are, what you do, what you're about. Sure. A lot of what I do now was shaped in my life.
and my mother. It's really hard to share anything about my life without sharing the life of my mom and dad. My dad was really a renaissance man. He wore many hats. Among the hats he wore was chaplain, chiropractor, naval officer, bodybuilder, martial artist, champion swimmer, author, poet. artist, just an amazing man.
And it was really his work in chiropractic care that [00:03:00] set me on the trajectory in life that I'm still currently on. My dad was an advocate for holistic integrated wellness, and he believed that God gave mankind the innate ability to maintain health if we are in alignment. Now, at the most rudimentary level, the alignment my dad spoke to was the alignment of the spine.
But that was just the beginning for the principle that he instilled in me. The principle being that every variable in our life needs to come into alignment. And you think about the spine, it's vertical. When it's working correctly. So there's this vertical alignment or this vertical integration that points up.
So my dad also wove into his chiropractic practice and the way that he raised me and my other brothers to know and to love and to serve Jesus. That was the pinnacle of. Being in alignment or being integrated was being under the lordship of Jesus. [00:04:00] So that's still what I'm trying to do in my walk today.
I'm still trying to find the variables that might be out of alignment. I'm trying to bring those into alignment. Trying to maintain integrity in everything that I say and everything that I do. And so you're in Georgia now, you're, you're back in law enforcement, you said. So what does life look like as you're leading people today and, and really preaching this message of integration?
I think for a lot of people, what you got, um, in your childhood and, and being taught early on this idea of integration and, You know, things aren't compartmentalized. They all affect each other, our body and our mind and our spirit. They all are, are part of a whole and you can't just separate them out into, into different buckets so to speak.
And so to get that real, that perspective early on, such a gift and it seems like something that most people probably aren't taught these days. And so kind of how, how do you get that message [00:05:00] out and what does that look like? Well, I've been thinking a lot recently about. Jesus in his teaching that he is the way, the truth, and the life.
And I think that depending on where God has placed us at any given time in our life, we can minister the way, or we can minister the truth, or we can minister the life. Now, currently I'm serving in a governmental context. So the best way for me to minister, best way for me to share the gospel, is demonstrating the way.
Because I can demonstrate the way in my life, in my behavior, in my approach to circumstances, in my interaction with other people, in my daily disciplines. I can model, I can demonstrate the way. Now keep in mind, the way that I'm demonstrating is the way of Christ. I'm following his way. [00:06:00] Just like Paul said, follow me even as I follow Christ.
So if people were following Paul during his life, they were really following the master. If people are following me, if I'm following Jesus, by way of extension, if people follow me in my way, they're following Jesus. So I found that in the context that I currently am, being aware of my behavior, of what I say, of how I say it, the way I interact with people, that's all just another way of sharing the gospel and sharing my faith.
Then modeling that way that might lead to a conversation about the truth, then that might lead to a conversation about the one in whom we find eternal life. But if we reverse engineer the sequence of events, it started with the demonstration or modeling of the way, but that's simply because of the context that I find myself in.
If it were a different context, [00:07:00] then I might just start with the truth. So I think it's just being sensitive, being aware of where God has placed us. And being strategic in the way that we share the one whom we love and serve. I love that. And I love the sequence, you know, and it just starts with demonstrating that in our, in our day to day life so often.
And just in the integration and realizing how important it is to have the different aspects of ourselves all in alignment, you know, going back to the, to the chiropractic. I mean, that, that just goes so well together. Talk a little bit about what an integrated life looks like, you know, for someone who hasn't heard that or, or considered that before and, and understood, well, what does my body have to do with my faith or what is my mindset and the words I say or the thoughts that I think, how does that have to do anything with, with my faith and my walk?
What does that really look like for somebody who's, who's never considered that before? Right, right. Well, it's such a [00:08:00] timely question because a lot of my prayer time is spent contemplating this. Because I interact with a lot of phenomenal leaders, a lot of phenomenal teachers who are teaching an integrated way to life.
So I imagine that anyone that we would invite to be a guest on our podcasts, if we're inviting that person onto the show with someone that we hold in esteem, because they're leading people, they're likely leading an integrated life. Because what would be the opposite proclamation? Follow me. My life is completely unintegrated.
It's completely chaotic. It makes absolutely no sense. Follow me. Right. Highly unlikely that that person is going to have an audience. Right. So the question then is, if I am proposing to you in this conversation, an integrated life, holistic life, [00:09:00] what's the difference between a Christian proclaiming an integrated holistic life and a non Christian?
Are we teaching the same thing? Can the goals be achieved in either methodology? And it's remarkable that that seems to be what Jesus was struggling with during his ministry, during his life, because the mindset of the Hebrew people was works righteousness. They really thought they were leading an integrated life.
They thought that that would put them in a position where God owed them. So even if they weren't conceptualizing integrated life, holy life, upright life, righteousness with eternal salvation, They were certainly equating that with blessedness, with favor. [00:10:00] So isn't that what we're potentially proposing?
Lead an integrated life, be holistic, receive blessing. Or if you want to use a more secular word, receive abundance. Achieve your goals, achieve your dreams, follow these programs. follow these steps, climb these mountains, you too can achieve your dreams, your goals. Is there a difference you see between that being a self centered endeavor thinking through the, in terms of what is this going to give me versus when I do live an integrated life and my, my body, my mind, my soul is, is something that I am pursuing mastery of every single day.
That puts me in a position of being able to serve. Right. And so it's really about other people. And and being able to demonstrate through your actions and how you live rather than I'm doing this thing just to accomplish my own goals and for my own outcomes, right? I [00:11:00] think what a lot of the hinges on is grace.
So consider this in conversations I've had with Mark Divine. He's written forwards to my book. I've appeared on his experience. Podcast. I've taught alongside him at unbeatable mind summits. Something that we've agreed on is the premise that self mastery in service of others. is the path of the warrior.
Mastering ourselves to be a better, greater service to other people. Seems congruent with the Christian message. Master ourselves to serve in God's kingdom. However, what's remarkable is I had overlooked one of the plain truths of scripture for so long. We're hard pressed to to [00:12:00] open up the words of the Bible to find any teaching on self mastery.
But what we see a lot of is being mastered. So you think about who we are in scripture. Well, okay, we're sheep. Sheep aren't doing a lot of self mastery. Not a big part of the sheep lifestyle. What's going for it is its shepherd. Right? So who else are we in scripture? Well, we are wives. to a husband. How's that for men?
Right. How manly is that? Right. Yeah. That that's something that I certainly haven't considered before. Right. But it's plain as day in scripture. That's who we are. And we also see ourselves portrayed as broken, as lost, as rebellious, as utterly sinful, dead in our transgressions. That raises the question, what can a [00:13:00] dead person do for themself?
It's a great question. Absolutely nothing. There's no hope for self mastery for a dead person. So I am so enthusiastic about the idea, the general idea, of self mastery and service of others. I'm all for it. What I'm up to these days is just praying that God would give me insight on how to We can hold in balance the idea that Jesus is my master, but I'm also pursuing self mastery.
How can those things that seem to be almost a paradox, how can someone who's mastered, that's me, mastered by the Lord, which makes me a slave. He's my master. He, he has made me a slave. So how can a slave walk the path of self mastered? That would be the path of the master, not the slave. So [00:14:00] just recently, I have had some clarity on this.
Jesus, when he warns his apostles, his disciples about the inevitable persecution that will come when you follow the way of the master, he says, well, a servant is not above. his master, but is like his master. Let's go into that a little bit. Well, we can unpack it together. A servant is not above his master.
So if my master is Jesus, I'm not ever going to be above my master, but I can be like my master. And there's significant scripture regarding that very phenomena that takes place through the process of the Holy Spirit going within us. The message translation, it's beautiful. Second Corinthians 3, 18, and that particular translation, it describes it as a process of becoming more and [00:15:00] more like The one who's dwelling within us other images that are used in scripture is looking into a mirror.
But if I look into a mirror in my bathroom, I see my face reflected back to me. But if I look into the face of Jesus, I see Jesus reflected back to me. So I think there is something there. I think that there might be a way for a Christian to be enthusiastic, to be hopeful about walking the path of self mastery.
Just being aware that along that path, the transformation that's taking place is a function of ultimately being mastered, which results in me becoming like the one who's mastered me, my Lord. I love that picture. And I do believe that those can both be congruent and in something that you can pursue at the same time, you know, pursuing, you know, self mastery, but then understanding that that is not a [00:16:00] substitute, nor, you know, checks the same boxes, submitting and surrendering to Christ and two different things, but they can also.
You know, I even think of self mastery as something that can be done in obedience because I'm going to treat my body as a temple, I'm going to take my thoughts captive, I'm going to master my emotions so that I can love more deeply. And, you know, all of that in alignment with just being surrendered to Christ and following his example.
Mm hmm. Mm hmm. You know, what comes to mind, I sense a spirit now is moving in this conversation. In Romans 8, Paul says, if through the spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live. So, it sounds a lot like self mastery. It's just that the ingredient that activates the possibility of putting to death the misdeed to the body is the Holy Spirit.
Yeah, adding that faith component in the, and [00:17:00] I've talked about this in other podcasts. If you, if you, you can have all the physical and mental and emotional mastery, but if you don't have the, the spiritual, and I wouldn't even call it mastery, but really the surrender on that end, you know, that that's what.
Really makes all the other worthwhile or makes it relevant, I guess. Right, right. Now consider though that anyone who possess integrated life will teach mind, body, spirit. They have to. So even a very secular, someone that's basing their methodology in dualism or in stoicism, which I know is popular among many of the people that we rub shoulders with.
Even a stoic philosophy or worldview would teach some degree of [00:18:00] spiritual development, even in the government. In the governmental context, there are lesson plans in law enforcement training centers that advance the premise. Spiritual development for law enforcement is important. Absolutely. The officer is not fully integrated, but it's more of a generic.
Is it more of a generic approach though? It is. So we would have to really define our terms because when you and I speak about spirituality or spirit, we mean something much different than another teacher or student might conceptualize spirituality or spirit. We refer to spirit as in a person. So when I think spirit, I cannot separate my understanding of spirit from the Holy Spirit.
The spirit of power dwells within me through faith in Jesus. I love that. This is so powerful. [00:19:00] So you brought up, you know, the warrior mindset, you've, you've written your book, the warrior and the monk. Talk a little bit about shifting gears just slightly. You've obviously been in the military, been in law enforcement, and you talk about Mark Devine and, but for someone outside of that, what does a warrior spirit look like?
And, and, And I think of it almost more as, as a practice. It's not as much having this idea that you're just going to go fight with people or, uh, or whatever. But what do you look at and how do you integrate at this point, kind of that warrior, warrior lifestyle into your day to day? Right. Yes. Yes. So just like the impossibility of describing or explaining my life apart from mentioning my mother and father, same thing.
The warrior archetype has been such a big part of my life from my earliest childhood memories. It's the lifestyle. It's the walk. It's the path that I've always known. I wouldn't [00:20:00] know how to begin describing myself or explaining myself apart from a pursuit of developing the warrior ethos. within me. It's informed every decision that I've made.
And what's encouraging is that the warrior imagery, the warrior archetype, the warrior life, is interwoven throughout scripture. I was just studying this morning in Ephesians chapter six, We are commanded to put on the full armor of God. Well, who puts on armor, who dons armor, who picks up a sword, a warrior.
So there is something about that way, the warrior way. That I think is completely congruent with the Christian way. You know, I've read all of that so many times and there's a lot of other verses in the Bible and in places where it [00:21:00] talks about a warrior and you look at many of the men God called on do his work and many of them were warriors, but I've never thought of it quite to that degree that, you know, these were, this was almost a warrior culture or a warrior mindset.
again, not necessarily in the physical sense, certainly in the, in the spiritual sense, but, but I see the warrior ethos is just being such a mindset. And And I think it's something that you don't have to be necessarily in law enforcement or the military to, to embrace and embody. And so how can men who are, you know, just kind of living normal lives, they have a nine to five, maybe they're running a business, they have a family, but how can they integrate that into their life and, and really take hold of some of those principles in order to serve their family and their community better?
Well, the first thing I would warn people against is that the warrior. Archetype is not necessarily a function [00:22:00] of what you do. It's more a function of who you are. Well, a warrior may feel inclined to serve in a capacity where they are confronting injustice, they're confronting evil, they're pursuing those people.
that would potentially harm God's children. That could look like military or law enforcement service. However, a warrior could also serve as a teacher. A warrior could serve in any capacity because it's not necessarily what you do for income. It's not necessarily your profession. It's more a function of your frame of mind, of the way that you see the world around you, the way that you see yourself, the way that you carry yourself, the way that you discipline yourself, the way that you think, the way that you [00:23:00] speak.
That's all a function of the warrior. You know, what comes to mind too, recently, I'd overlooked this. It's amazing how when we're ready, not to repurpose the adage that when the student is ready, the teacher appears, but it does seem that when I'm ready, then scripture that I've read hundreds of times now has a function.
And what I've overlooked for a long time is we're told to put on this armor, which would imply that before the armor is put on, we're not wearing the armor. We're open and susceptible to attack in a way. Right, right. We're not. We don't have our [00:24:00] sword. It's not with us. These pieces of armor that are enabling us to be ferocious in battle, they're not on us.
But that's just one illustration of not wearing something. Another really remarkable illustration of not wearing something is when the apostles are in the boat, there's an instance where the storm comes up, the waves are coming over the bow of the boat, the boat is nearly swamped. The apostles are fearful.
They're terrified. Jesus is sound asleep in the back of the boat. So they wake up Jesus saying, Lord, don't you care if we drown? What he says is interesting. He says, where is your faith? Isn't that interesting? Where is it? Where did you put it? I mean, that's very profound, right? So it seems to be something that we put on.
[00:25:00] So just the other day I was in conversation regarding my childhood experience dressing up in my dad's naval uniform. There was something that happened when I put that uniform on. I actually still have a photograph of me wearing my dad's armor. I have my dad's scuba knife from his scuba diving with in my hand.
I've got his
I've dressed up in my dad's uniform. When I put that uniform on, it didn't fit me. It serves no functional purpose, but when I put it on, I was not the little boy that I was prior to wearing that uniform. I changed then fast forward 20 years. Now I'm serving in law enforcement. Something would [00:26:00] change in the locker room of 701 Ocean Street in Santa Cruz, California.
That was the address of the sheriff's office. When I went into the locker room in my board shorts with a t shirt on, then I opened up my locker. I put on my bulletproof vest. I put on my uniform shirt. I put my badge in place. Put my gun belt on, tied up my boots through that process, which took five or 10 minutes.
I was transforming. Then I walked upstairs to roll call, not the same person that walked in 701 Ocean Street 10 or 15 minutes earlier. Something transformed. Then I think 2004, my first time donning the uniform of the U. S. Army soldier. Something changed. Then I remember a conversation I had with Drill Sergeant Oliver, who was my senior drill instructor at Fort Sill, [00:27:00] Oklahoma, the day that we first donned the dress uniform of the U.
S. Army soldier. Staff Sergeant Oliver asked me if I knew the purpose of the dress uniform. I said no. Matter of fact, it didn't really make a lot of sense. Because I could not fight in that uniform. It was so constricting. Once I had everything buttoned up, I could barely move. It's to remind you that you're a professional soldier.
So at other times in boot camp, you wear your combat uniform. That's a reminder that you're called to fight. You're a warrior. Your call to engage in combat to close with for the enemy. But if that's the only uniform you wear, you might confuse yourself with a thug or with a mercenary. So you also are issued this uniform, this dress uniform to remind you that you're a professional, that you're under oath, that you're [00:28:00] under orders.
You're not a rogue. You have allegiance to something bigger than you and he was right when that uniform was dawned. Something else shifted in me. So just interest. I'm sure everyone can relate to this. We do dress up. We wear uniforms and when that uniform is on, it feels different than absent the uniform.
You talk about transformation, and I was talking with another guest the other day and mentioned the scripture that, you know, says to be transformed through the renewing of your mind. And to me, you put on that, you know, whether it's your dressing for battle or dressing for, you know, some formal event. In either case, you're putting on that new exterior.
But really what that does is shift your mindset and your perspective. Yeah. And you're trans, the man underneath is still the same, but it's that transformation that goes on in your, in your mind that is the significant shift. Mm hmm. Mm [00:29:00] hmm. Well, if we reverse engineer that transformation of mind, the first verse pertains to a warning.
Not to be conformed to the power of the world, but to be transformed by the renewing of your mind. So there's a conformity or there's a transformation. Now this is in Romans. So up to this point in Romans, what Paul is proposing is that through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, our mind is transformed.
We take on a new mind. We actually have the mind of Christ. It's the new mind. In Romans 8, Paul explains that the spirit dwelling within us prays for us. Then he explains that he who searches our heart knows the mind of the spirit, because the spirit intercedes for God's people in accordance. with the will [00:30:00] of God.
Then he goes on to say that we know that God works together all things in a pattern for good for those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. But if we reverse engineer this possibility that all things are working in my life in a pattern for good, It's because I have the mind of Christ.
So again, it really comes back to what we opened with, this discussion of mastery or being mastered. So self mastery would propose that I, as a function of my willpower, I control my mind, I control my thoughts, I control my actions, therefore I control my destiny. Sounds a lot like what Gandhi was teaching.
It's become your words, become your actions, habits, character, destiny. So we just follow this linear progression. We climb the mountain, we achieve self mastery in service of others. You can do it to sign up, [00:31:00] right? And then you get to the end of it and realize, well, hold on, I'm not quite there. So what, this must not be the thing.
What else is there? Right. Then the person goes on to the other person who's proposing self mastery and service these three steps. I mean, what's remarkable brother is that every January New York times, bestselling books come out on self mastered on achieving your goals on building the life of your dreams.
Then what happens a year from that? Well, that didn't work. So another offers cracked the code. I've got it. New York Times bestseller, and that's going to continue every year for the rest of our life. Meanwhile, all along scripture saying, how's that going for you? Yeah. How's that going? Probably not as well as you'd hoped it would, because that is fruitless and our ego resists it.
And this is where men, I think [00:32:00] really fall into a trap. is that we are so convinced that being a man is about controlling our circumstances, controlling ourselves, developing our willpower. This idea of surrender, how does that reconcile with the warrior ethos? How does that reconcile with someone who's teaching self mastery?
Surrender seems like giving up, giving in. You know, I think it can be, you know, I think it takes a whole another level to be able to set your ego aside and be humble and submit. You know, to God in that and to, to get to that end point that you realize that you're, you're not gonna get what you're seeking through your own, through your own efforts, through your own strength, through your own ability.
And being able to surrender to me is, is the greatest representation of, of a man's true strength and being able to [00:33:00] be submissive in that way. Very true. Very true. What's interesting too is that even in conversations I've had with people who are antagonistic to the Christian faith, they talk about using their innate gifts.
Where did those gifts come from? Who gave you those gifts? Who gave you those abilities that appear to be natural? Who gave you those abilities, those gifts, those talents, those attributes, those inclinations, those passions, those ideas, those insights, those revelations. So for the Christian, it's so easy. We see it all as grace.
Let me share this with you too, because this is maybe the mountains, the five mountains for the Christian. And it's the complete. opposite approach than the Five Mountains that we're so familiar with. So your listeners could find this In all four Gospels, but I [00:34:00] just happen to be in the Gospel of Matthew in chapter 20.
This is the parable of the workers in the vineyard. So I'll just paraphrase the parable of landowner goes out very early in the morning. The Israelite workday would have started at 6 a. m. So the landowner might have gone out at approximately 5 30 to hire people. to begin to work in his fields at 6 a. m.
So he hires people on the agreement that they will work for Adenarius. The agreement is made, they go to work. Then he goes back at 9 a. m., hires more workers with the same agreement. Then he goes at 12, hires more workers with the same agreement. Then at 3, then finally at 5. Now the Israelite workday would have ended at [00:35:00] approximately 6.
Everyone that's worked in his field was under the same agreement. They are working for Idenarius. Now at six o'clock, the end of the workday, the landowner goes to the foreman, tells the foreman to pay everyone what they're due, starting with the people that were hired by Idenarius. Last then ending with the people that were hired first.
So now use your imagination put yourself there imagine that you're the person that's hired last So there we are we're standing in line because we are going to be the first to be paid, even though we were the last hired. So I know that I've agreed to work for a denarius. I'm anticipating, expecting to get what I agreed to.
So I reach out my hand, the foreman gives me a denarius. I'm thankful, but it's exactly [00:36:00] what I expected to receive. Then the foreman goes to the person to my left, the person that was hired at three. They give them a denarius. Now I'm thinking to myself, well, I guess that makes sense because they were hired at three.
I was hired at five. They worked a little bit longer than me, but I could see how this is fair. Then the foreman goes to the person hired at twelve, gives them the denarius. Now I'm thinking to myself, wait a second, they were here half the day. I was here for an hour. Whoa. What's happening to my denarius, to the value of my denarius going up, it's gone up, then I'm looking down the road.
Now, let me set the person hired at nine. I'm like, what's happening. What's he going to give him a denarius. You gotta be kidding me. That the person at 6. AM a denarius. Oh my gosh. This, [00:37:00] this is worth so much more. Okay. Then I realized this is amazing. But meanwhile, if we take the posture of the person hired at 6am, what's happened to the value of their denarius?
They've seen it just go down and devalue, devalue. So I think that the person hired at 6am, they're the mindset of climbing the mountains. They're climbing the mountains expecting that all the work they put in will increase. in value, then you just fill in the blank as to what value is important in your life.
That's the posture of works righteousness that Jesus came to unravel. Because the Pharisees the workers that were hired at 6am. But the Gentiles, the sinners, the tax collectors, That's me. That's you. We're the ones hired last, but [00:38:00] the posture that we have is a posture of grace, a posture of surrender, a posture of recognizing I don't deserve this denarius that I've been given.
This doesn't make any sense, but I am going to receive it. With that posture of humility, of meekness, of gratitude, of just utter, I can only explain it by pointing to the one who gave it to me. My only explanation is I just have to point to that foreman. But for the Christian, the only explanation I just have to point to the Lord.
I can't explain it apart from that. It wouldn't make sense. And that's how I want to live. I want to live in such a way that all the evidence, you know, being in law enforcement, I've been trained to look for evidence and I want all the evidence to point to the Lord. The only explanation for my life should be, I have to [00:39:00] explain it by grace.
How do you see God show up in those moments? You know, when you're out doing, doing your normal day, you know, you're out on the streets, you're, serving, how do you see God showing up for you in your day to day life? Is there any example you could point to and just kind of really, I guess, bring to life and to color like what that, that looks like as you experience it?
Yeah, it's kind of a more tangible objective. Well, the way that I'm serving now is I'm serving as a law enforcement instructor. I work for the federal government as instructor as a teacher. So I am not serving on the street. I'm hopefully educating, inspiring people that are on the street to make good decisions, to use sound tactics, to train hard, to have an integrated life.
So everything that we're talking about, there is a governmental application to that. So I find that Very often I get ideas that can only be [00:40:00] explained by God's grace. So ideas for even while teaching I'm behind the podium for up to four hours at a time going through a PowerPoint that I've given numerous times using notes that I've read over.
Numerous times, and all of a sudden, a flash of insight, a new way of relating to the principle that I'm teaching, or I'll be looking at my audience, then God will give me some sense of what someone might be dealing with, so I can relate an example to that person's current circumstances. Is it almost like an intuitive, an intuitive guidance?
Yeah, there's kind of a inner sense and inner guidance. Not to be confused with, you know, even in, in biblical studies, there, there's some confusion regarding words of knowledge or words of insight [00:41:00] apart from any real inspiration, which is reserved for scripture. I do think that God just helps me understand things that apart from him, I just wouldn't be able to understand.
Same thing in my academic studies, I'm pursuing a doctorate in ministry. God just gives me grace. He just helps me understand the topics that I'm researching. He gives me grace in my writing. I even hope he's giving me grace out in conversation with you, just helping me to have ideas to share that will find a place in the heart of the people that listen to these words.
For people listening in talking about integration, talking about surrendering in faith, what are some of the practices that you're currently following and just kind of implement in your day to day that keep you connected and keep you on path? Sure. So one of the really important spiritual disciplines is being hyper [00:42:00] sensitive to the power of the tongue.
This is all throughout scripture, warning about the power of the tongue, the power of the tongue. James elaborates on this, but he's just reinforcing what we see in Psalms, what we see in Proverbs. He's reinforcing what he learned from Jesus. The tongue has the power of life. and death. And another illustration, talk about being mastered, an illustration that James uses is a bit that goes into a horse's mouth.
He uses that illustration for the tongue. So that bit is very small, two or three inches at the most, but that bit, once in the horse's mouth, it can turn. The horse. The other illustration he uses is the rudder of a vessel. It's a small member [00:43:00] of the ship, but the captain at the wheel can turn the entire ship by just adjusting the rudder.
So whether it be the rudder that you resonate with or the bit that you resonate with, in either case, the implication is profound that that tongue masters us. So the only hope for my tongue is to let my tongue be mastered. So the trajectory, the direction of my life can be in accordance with the will of God.
So a practice that I've adopted Is called first words, and it's just a way of disciplining myself every day to be aware of what I say, and I always speak in the morning scripture. So the first words [00:44:00] that I say are from the Bible. I've been repeating Psalm 46 verse one now for approximately seven years.
God is my refuge. God is my strength. God is my ever present help in time of trouble. I just let that be the first thing that I say every morning. I found that when I am aware of the first thing that I say in the morning, when my first words are scripture, every subsequent word that I speak during the day.
is just more intentional, more aware of what I'm saying. That is, uh, I heard you speak on that quite some time ago. I think it was a podcast or something. And that was such a profound, it's so simple. And I think that's one of the things that's pretty easy for men. I think that a lot of times we're looking for the magic formula or something that's, that's almost very complicated or very difficult.
And that's such a simple thing. It's simple to do, but yet it's also [00:45:00] just as easy not to do it. But the profound impact of, of doing that every single day in that habit compounding over time and how it shifts your mindset, makes you more aware of your words. And so you're speaking to the people you interact with.
Maybe that's your spouse and your kids, maybe that's your, your teammates or your family, friends. But if you're speaking with more love and more grace, simply because you have that. of taking your thoughts and your words captive first thing and surrendering what you say and, and, I've taken it to, you know, what do I think?
What do I speak? What do I hear? What do I write? So using all four of those is a way to really, um, just kind of ingrain powerful, positive words. And using scripture is, is just a fantastic example of how to do that. Jesus said out of the abundance of the heart, mouth speaks. So there [00:46:00] is something about storing up God's word.
In our heart, it doesn't necessarily mean that the only thing that comes out of my mouth is scripture, scripture, scripture, right? The ideas that come out of my mouth are shaped.
I think that's so important. There's so many influences and so much distraction. I mean, you can get up and get on your cell phone, go to social media, go to the news, go to your email. There's so many things that you could do other than the positive actions. And especially, you know, a lot of who I'm trying to speak to through this podcast are men who are married with families and.
for them to have a practice that allows them to put themselves in a position of being loving, present, playful, patient fathers and men when their family wakes up in the [00:47:00] morning. It's it's small little habits and practices like this that I believe do ingrain a different attitude over time and do help them to cultivate all of those All of those elements and I guess habits and that allow them to do that.
And so it's just a beautiful way of. Of really being intentional around that. I'm curious. Do you still train jiu jitsu or Krav Maga or any of the martial arts? I do That's something that i've done Krav Maga, but i've just gotten into Jiu jitsu lately and I have found that that is an amazing way of bringing presence into the moment and Understanding how to breathe and remain calm and present under pressure, but I had that I thought I would You Ask and see if that's something that you still utilize.
It is, it is. I achieved my black belt in Krav Maga, August, 2018. I've [00:48:00] continued to train ever since. And I'm a purple belt in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. I was introduced to Jiu Jitsu through training in CrossFit. It was always a big part of the CrossFit program in Santa Cruz. Many of the top level competitors were using CrossFit for their conditioning and preparation for Krav Maga.
their world championship fights. So those two martial arts have a special place in my heart. I don't think there's anything more exhausting than fighting. And you find out real quick how in shape or out of shape you are. And just that, um, that ability to catch your breath and, and just is just. It can be very humbling, a very humbling experience to, uh, to roll, but that is such a, um, for me has become a very, uh, valuable practice just to give.
When I get home, my wife says, wow, you're in a really good mood. I can tell you've been to a jujitsu this morning, so it's helping me show up as a better father and husband. I think that is [00:49:00] awesome. Maybe it's just the stress release too, that it gives. Well, as we begin to, uh, come to the end of our conversation, what are some practical things that you would say to men who maybe they're struggling day to day in some element or area of their life, whether that be spiritual or maybe in their physical health or?
You know, maybe they haven't considered their mindset before and just the power of, of the words that they use and the thoughts that they think, what are some really practical ways that there are things that men could take away from this conversation and implement so that they could show up better for the people they serve?
Earlier, we spoke about the way the truth, the life. It's interesting to read the Gospels through the lens of the way of Jesus. What did Jesus do? What was his daily rhythm? In Mark chapter one, beginning in verse 35, I'll just read this for the [00:50:00] edification of the listener. It says, very early in the morning, while it was still dark, Jesus got up, left the house.
and went off to a solitary place where he prayed. That's an incredible verse. So this might be something that men can follow, a practice that we can follow. Can we get up while it's still dark, while other people in our family are still asleep? Can we get out of bed? Can we go to a place that's reserved? A solitary place that set a sign for just one purpose, for a communion with the Lord, to pray.
Because something I mentioned on a podcast a few months ago that really resonated with a lot of people that listened to it, is the person that needed to pray the [00:51:00] least, we see in scripture praying the most. Jesus was a man of prayer. So what does that say for men today? We need to be mad that if that was important enough for Jesus to have in his day to day, then how much more exactly is that necessary and needed in our own lives?
That's that's such a great, beautiful perspective on that. Exactly. So up early as a discipline, silence, silence, As a discipline, solitude as a discipline, opening up the pages of scripture as a discipline, reading the Bible as a discipline, memorizing God's word as a discipline. That's all something that could be.
participated in that could all become one practice 15 to [00:52:00] 20 minutes every morning that can radically begin to shape our life. We can become more like Jesus, more like the master, just a little bit, a little bit every day, a little bit every day. So it's It's, um, someone, if it's helpful, someone could see that practice or those practices as a function of self mastery.
I would just encourage those people that are Christian to see that what's happening is we are becoming mastered by the one that we're studying, by the one who we're praying to, by the one who's drawing within us, by the one that we're spending time with. So if it's helpful, sure, there is an element of self mastery involved, or if it's helpful, you can see it as just complete surrender.
But either way, the goal or the purpose of these practices is to become [00:53:00] like the one who we're following or to become like the one who is our master, who is our Lord, who is our God. That mindset and perspective of stepping into the day, not in a pursuit of self mastery, but in a pursuit of surrender. in the, in all the areas of our lives and just letting God lead us in that.
That's just such a, a great and powerful perspective. I really appreciate you sharing that. That's just something I haven't necessarily considered, but it just, I think, adds even more depth to the work that I do each day. And I think work that men can do is, you know, it's, it's not as much about self mastery.
It's really about Surrendering and allowing God to guide and lead our lives to then serve the people that he's placed in our lives to serve. Well said, brother. I agree. Wow. Greg, this has been a real pleasure and honor having you on. You just bring so much wisdom and perspective and depth of thought, especially as it [00:54:00] relates to my faith and Uh, just greatly appreciate everything that you've shared today.
There's just a lot of wisdom and you can tell there's so much contemplation that has gone into all of all that you shared today. If someone listening to this wanted to connect with you and hear more about what you've got going on, where would they be able to find you? Well, that's a good question. Um, probably Instagram, Gregory Amundsen on Instagram, or they could listen to my podcast.
I think my website is still up gregoryamundsen. com. So from that website, they could probably connect with the other outlets that are available. Well, we'll, uh, we'll be sure to share. that in the notes and also make sure that we get some of the books put up there just so that if anyone wants to dive deeper into, into your work and, uh, and what all you've put out, then, uh, then they can certainly do so.
And, [00:55:00] and that would be a blessing to them. Right on. I appreciate it. Thank you. Awesome. Well, thank you for joining us today. I greatly appreciate it. And this has been a fantastic conversation. Thank you, brother. We ask that if you found value in this, that you subscribe to the podcast and share with someone that you think would find value in this as well.
If there's a man that, you know, who would benefit from this, please share it with them. We want to get. These messages and these tools and resources out to as many men as we can so that marriages can be thriving, families can heal, so kids have great dads, so that wives have great husbands, and one man at a time in this world we can make a [00:56:00] difference.